This is probably a weird topic for discussion, so first let me acknowledge that 1. virginity to me is nothing more than a social construct with greatly overblown significance, 2. We as humans care way too much about labeling & categorizing ourselves in regards to everything, and 3. I'm writing this with horny-brain, so please don't think my wife and I are taking this discussion too seriously. Anyway, I've talked a lot on this site about the agreement that my wife and I have. That is, my penis is never allowed to penetrate her (or anyone's) vagina ever again. Keep in mind that we are both each other's firsts (and only), and we've only ever had sex a handful of times over the course of our now 16 year relationship (roughly 12 times total, 0 times in the last 3 years). I made my previous post about this not long after we agreed to permanently abstain, and if you're wondering how we've been dealing with it since then... well, we couldn't be happier with that decision. There's so much less pressure on both of us, and continuous chastity has helped us find countless other ways to be just as, or even more, intimate with each other. In fact, we can't help but feel a small tinge of regret for having sex in the first place. Although we hold onto the fact that I have never cum inside of her (and never will), we obviously can't take back the act of penetration. Still, there's something alluring about the idea that she could have kept me a virgin forever while retaining the option to save herself for someone else. I know this isn't the cuckolding forum and not everyone's into that, but it's crazy to think how we narrowly missed that sort of life by just a few, er... insertions (lacking a better word). Recently, I stumbled across the notion of 'Born Again Virgins' and while the movement tends to be a little too religion-oriented for me, I love the idea of somehow reclaiming our virginities and identifying ourselves as such going forward. Of course, we're aware that our status has never been (and likely never will be) called into question, and I can't imagine it will ever come up conversationally with anyone else. That said, it may be fun and somewhat reassuring to refer to each other as virgins once again... her in the traditional female-purity sense and me in a stereotypical inadequate-male sense. To be clear, I'm not really asking whether or not this is legitimate or okay to do. After all, people - especially in the kink community - do all sorts of mental gymnastics to categorize themselves under various labels and identities all the time. But if you'll humor us with your imaginations for a bit, my question is this... What do you think a couple like us should do to "officially" reclaim our virginities (even if just for the sake of roleplay)? I'm asking this in the FLR forum since FLR couples seem to be really good at coming up with all sorts of creative rules and rituals for so many aspects of their relationships. Here are some vague ideas I've been tossing around... Once we've hit a certain milestone (e.g., 5 years without PIV, 1 year in chastity without orgasm, etc.) Once we perform some kind of act or ritual in order to "undo" our few instances of penetration Once I or both of us endure a certain punishment as penance for having sex Just use the fact that I've never cum inside of her Something more relationship-oriented and not related to sex/kink?
So, this happened before my time in the kink scene, so I heard about it second-hand from the bride. However, this does strongly involve some edgy kinky stuff - so there's your trigger warning. A Seattle kink community leader, who identifies as a switch, related the story of her bachelorette play party. She was marrying her dominant (I think) so the limits of her last kinky play party as a single woman were laid out by him: she couldn't be penetrated with anything she couldn't be bled I think that was pretty much it, which allows for a lot if you any kinky people. While everyone played and had lots of orgasms and bruises and whatever, there was a blood play scene going on elsewhere - possibly involving knives or scalpels. Everyone had a lovely time. The next day, the bridal party, the groomsmen, and the soon to be married couple had a meal together and, as proof of the bride's "virginity," a bloody sheet from someone else's cutting scene was brought out as "evidence". He beamed proudly. As of that date, the woman said that it was the sweetest thing that anyone had ever done for her: bled simply to start her marriage off right. So, if you want to mess with the concept of "virginity" without believing in magically restoring your bodies to that state or forgetting what coitus feels like ... it's been done at least once before in fairly non-religious ways.
You are technically still a virgin and so is she. If you didnt cum inside that is... then you haven't consumated the marriage. Feel better? .
Mrs Chaste likes to refer to me as a born again virgin sometimes! I'm not sure if she's joking or not, I've not been inside her for nearly a year now! Apparently my tongue and her strap on is much more satisfying!
Haha, like I said above, we're not exactly stressing about this issue. If nothing else, this thread will be interesting just to hear what people's definitions of virginity are. We've always considered it lost the moment the penis penetrates the vagina (i.e., beyond "just the tip") regardless of internal ejaculation. Your definition seems to imply that it's one in the same with consummation, which I've always thought to be separate. At the very least, I do agree that because I've never cum inside her, then consummation has never occurred and most certainly never will. I suppose it's probably not worth arguing whose definition / interpretation is correct (cough, social construct), especially when there are those who believe that virginity can also be lost through activities as simple as fingering or oral sex...both of which we absolutely will continue to do on the regular. I'm more curious to hear what steps people think a couple should take in order to consider themselves virgins again no matter what criteria is used. Since I know nothing official exists for this situation (anyone can easily just say what they believe themselves to be and leave it at that), hopefully this thread can just be a fun thought-experiment. Glad we're not the only ones!
What a fascinating thread! Thanks for starting it HisFreakySide. My wife no longer allows me intercourse. Last time was maybe five years ago. I've mentioned before that her reasoning is that it's simply inappropriate for a woman (speaking for herself) to allow a chaste man inside of her. In the early days of our marriage, I was inside of her a lot. But one thing that NEVER happened: I was never allowed to cum inside her. So we are like you guys in that regard. I think your idea of attaining some sort of milestone as a means to declare a new virginity is absolutely delightful. Partly kinky, but also partly beautiful. Maybe it is that proverbial full year locked and not allowed orgasm. Hard to say. But the threshold should be a difficult one to reach. Also, I think it's a good idea to come up with the right moniker for a renewed virgin. I agree with you that for the woman, she is simply not allowing a chaste man inside of her. And for the male, he is being denied. So the title for both should reflect that. Compulsory Virgin for him?
I hear what you mean, no biggie, but to me you can put it in once and take it out, that's not having sex. So how long or how many thrusts? 2, 5, 50? It's better to have a marker, and to me that's completion. I know that if I had never known what climax feels like with a woman, especially one you love so dearly, i would consider myself a virgin. Albeit one who has "fooled around" a lot.
Virginity as a concept becomes relevant when an individual reaches pubescence. Most men go through puberty at around the age of 13. Therefore, if your caging was a rebirth, then you become a virgin again after at least 13 years without sex. Of course since you're both adults, 18 years might be more relevant. Do what with that as you will.
The beauty of this is how we are only limited by our imaginations since no official process exists. I think it would be a lot of fun to pretend like one does... "Follow these exact steps and society will recognize you as a virgin once again." Not sure what that would look like, but I agree, it probably should be a somewhat difficult process that's achieved over a lengthy period of time. That's a great way to look at. Though I feel like this is where a woman's perspective would be great to have, especially when women tend to place a lot more meaning behind the act of penetration. It's their bodies that are being entered, after all. Not to speak for anyone, but I can imagine many women would believe that their virginity is in fact lost upon the first thrust. Just thinking out loud here: I suppose both views can co-exist if you define virginity based on gender- in which a woman need only be penetrated while a man must orgasm while inside. That would carry a really weird consequence for my wife and me, though. Based on that line of thinking, I am very much a virgin by definition whereas she lost her status...by me. Hmm, maybe I should just be thankful none of this has any real meaning in life!
Here is something I found years ago. I forget the source. But it cites the late Ellen White. Note the line where she's says it is the DUTY of the wife to restrain her husband..... And Ellen G. White, pioneering author advised back in 1915: “Men, like animals, become perverted sexually and victims of an exaggerated sexual craving when masturbation and intercourse are permitted. It is degrading to allow men and boys a seminal emission without rational and proper cause. Unless procreation is desired, ensure that the final propagative orgasm be entirely done away with. Sexual excess will effectually destroy a husband’s love for devotional gestures, and no woman should aid her husband in this work of self-destruction. The more these revolting passions are indulged, the stronger they become, and the more pathetic will be their clamors for consent. It is the duty of the ideal wife to restrain the desires of her husband if she has true love for him. We instruct strict, absolute, constant male chastity to the middle aged. As years increase, the act of seminal emission should be more and more rarely permitted; and ought to at last be wholly avoided when near the age of 50. It may be necessary to humbly and affectionately insist that, even at the risk of his displeasure, that she cannot debase her body by yielding to his excess sexual urges.”
Ehhh, I can't deny that quote aligns very neatly with the basis of orgasm denial, but you have to admit it's a little cherrypicked from its source. We probably shouldn't get too comfortable using religiously-founded philosophies to inspire our kinks.
Oh, I freely admit that it was Cherry Picked. I apologize if I was vague on that. But as you see, at least SOMEONE from the past understood in some intuitive way that a loving wife will deny her husband for his own good. Pop culture may have some more basis for this. For example, there's a classic joke that has existed forever: How do you get a Jewish woman to stop having sex? Marry her.
While the virginity train has long left the station for me, as a man, it does remain intact for my sissy side. I've not consummated any sexual relations where I am penetrated for the pleasure of another. So technically an oral and anal virgin, I'm not sure if I'll remain that way. Given the right circumstances, I might forgo, again, my virginity. But I am pretty sure that I'll never penetrate someone else again, and so might function as a virgin in that area. For you, I think, having some ceremony or abstinence time frame might be suitable to re-establish your virginity. Good luck and enjoy.