Punishment is complicated

The idea if punishment foes nothing for me. More than that, I actually hate the idea. It means I failed. Any punishment is a massive issue for me. Punishments are centred on the person being punished, and I never want that.

 

I agree punishment has got to be something that you don't really like to do

Mistress too is very fond of her paddle, sometimes Ill actually ask for it if i am feeling frustrated. I still don't like it but it gives me relief for some reason. Punishment is when she takes it beyond my comfort zone, and she gets that smile on her face and says "get back in position or you will get more"

Also recently she had me put in the butt plug electric probe with a remote control electric shock device. I was told I could cum if I could. Every time I came near or looked like i was enjoying myself she would up the current to painful, enough that I was clawing at bedclothes writhing (and I dare not remove the plug or pull on the wires). I cant say I liked that very much either so I would count that as a punishment if she did it again, but then probably like it because I was getting attention. Usually she uses the shocker while I am massaging her shoulders...if i stop or do something she doesn't like I get stung.

Its a fine line between pleasure and punishment.

 

It’s mentioned in a lot of places that your KH should give you the keys back if your not living up to their expectations. My wife said to me the other day that I was being grumpy and that if it carried on, I should just go and take it off. As the children where around and about I didn’t say anything back but when she went out I sent her a text saying “where are the keys then?”. In brief, my phone didn’t send it as a iMessage and tried as a plain text - but it never got there!!
Circumstances like this, I would be more than happy to jack it in, pleasure my self and to hell with it. It would be no punishment to give me the key.
Adding another week (longer?) before being unlocked and being told that was the punishment would be much better...

 

Refuse to give the key back and whipping for bad behavior would have been suitable would create a memory not to repeat it

 

So much goes into physical aspect of punishments. Here are couple of things on my mind.
First I feel like punishments should happen very rarely hopefully next to none. If I submit, I know what is expected of me, I know how we are going to shape our dynamic and I'll make sure I know the way. Communication and working out the details helps me to do all that then with everything in mind I make a decision to submit or not. If I do, Chances are that I will RARELY be punished. There will be times that I might stray, whether it's trying to achieve a goal and choosing the wrong path to get there or just letting my emotions and temper or ego get the best of me lets face it we are all human and we make mistakes.

In that case the first one to punish me is me. This is very common in submissives, however I say if any one of us Dominant or submissive disappoint our partner, we would feel horrible. In that case being confronted and bringing everything to light and being asked to think about what I did wrong for couple of days is very effective for me. It also gives both of us the chance to calm down and think about what happened and make a decision with a clear head.

If for whatever reason the mistake keeps on repeating maybe getting ignored or going back to Vanilla for couple of months or no hugs or cuddles and so on... Depends on both parties, will probably have an imprint.

Serious physical punishment could be saved for last resort that way it has way more weight to it and is hell a lot more effective.

I think back to my kid days and remember that I only got beat if I TRULY pissed my parents off and I was a handful even still I only got beat twice. I remember them to this day and I also don't do those things that caused me to get punished at all.

 

Like Nicoftime already did I think it is important to differ between play, maybe roleplay and real punishment punishment.
What is the difference between those three for me ?

- roleplay: Here it is about boths or only Subs pleasure.The 'submissives' pleasure is always included. Although one could argue about whether the passive part in such cases should still be considdered a Sub...

- play: Here it is the other way round - always about the dominants wants and needs. But it can also be about Subs pleasure if it is what she wishes. However, in this his pleasure is as little garantueed as his comfort.

- punishment: For us punishments are a rather rare thing, but it is always something that is outside my comfortzone for sure. I would definitely not go that far and say it is something I fear (that would be quite harsh, wouldn't it ?), but it is always something I would wish to avoid.

If it is about the common example pain (and I am not into pain for sure) the difference between play and punishment would be that in play she would try comfort me - even if the would bush my limits quite a bit.If it's about punishment she would make sure, that there is no comfort at all. Although there usually is no need in this as the setting alone usually does its part...

But punishment does not alsways have to be physical... How about writing lines or writing an essay about what you did wrong and why ? If you are in FLR that includes other aspects of your life as well how would you feel her canceling appointments or courses you really like to attend ?Almost like some 20 years ago with childs: "If you do not clean your plate you are not gonna play with your friend".

There are really more than enough ways to make someone regret something if the FLR includes most aspects of your life....

 

a puck liking to be spanked says i am doing it wrong. yes i understand there are those who like pain but most of them have their limit too. then again for me if it is going to be more than 2 swats he is restrain and gagged so it can be as severe as i feel the offense deserves without any interference. once this routine was established most behavior modification only takes a word.

 

i know some men like being hit with things cos I seen them and as well they pay money for it. I dont like being hit and I wud never ever ask Mistress to be paddled and when I am I always say I wont do nothing to have it again ever but it just happen sometimes and its hard to be very good all the time I think.

 

Great post. I also enjoy fun spanking and dread the no-nonsense hard core beat down on my arse. The Mrs delays punishment. She will calmly inform me that it's going to happen, then let me stew in dread for a day or two. She tells me when it will occur so I'm left watching the clock like a condemned man waiting for the axe to fall.
It's brutally effective, mentally and physically because I hate pain, and dread wears me down emotionally.

 

I have a hard time with this concept. As far as play goes, I love the idea of pretending you've been bad and need to be put over my knee and spanked, flogging you because we both like it, or putting you in the corner because it turns you on to feel denied of interaction in this way. If it's fun for one of us, and the other one is game, or if it's fun for both of us, then I get it.

But to actually feel the need to punish a partner of mine? Something has gone terribly wrong. We are supposed to care about each other, and we are adults. If he's done something to intentionally hurt or anger me, there is a larger problem that needs to be discussed. If he's made a mistake and knows it, maybe had a momentary fit of anger and said or done something regrettable - he's probably already punishing himself in ways that hurt more than a paddle.

Everyone makes mistakes. If they've caused pain and don't feel regret and sorrow at what they've done, that would indicate to me that maybe this is a relationship I don't need to be in.

I'm sure a large factor in my take on this is due to the fact that I want "punishment" to always be a fun thing.

 

I am a submissive cuckold. I always receive a maintenance caning once a date has been set for my wife to meet her bull. The caning is severe but of limited duration. Up to now this arrangement has been successful in reminding me to keep any bad behaviour in check, particularly, if I let any angst and jealously show overtly in a way that would spoil her time with her bull. Recently, she had to take a short break from her meetups due to a medical issue but she is now back on track. During the break I was not caned and memories are short so I made some indiscretions which I regret and a severe caning is going to happen soon. I accept that but we both now appreciate just how effective the regular maintenance canings have been. I see this as a gift from her because she wants to help me with my behaviour.

 

What is she ordered you back into the room and explained how the sassing was unacceptable, and had NOT paddled you? Do you think you would have felt that same sense of resolution, or no?

 

Okay, well I will definitely keep that in mind. I guess I can't know unless I try, right?

 

This is a fascinating thread and the different responses from different people are particularly interesting. The 24/7 lifestylers seem to view punishment very differently to funsters like us. I know that there are lots of different types of punishment, but I would like to concentrate my comments on spanking. In my opinion, spanking is a fundamental part of a domme/sub relationship and has a very deep psychological impact on both partners.

My girlfriend and I have a sort of unspoken agreement when it comes to spanking. She knows that she can spank me anytime she wants to. She only has to say the word and, without hesitation, I will bare my behind and present it to her. Just the fact that I will submit to her in this way gives her power over me, whether she chooses to use that power or not. She doesn't use it as much or as often as I'd like her to, but I'm not complaining.

So without a blow being struck, there is a huge psychological effect on me. Being exposed, vulnerable and a little humiliated gives me a real submissive buzz. It actually has nothing to do with pain. I don't like pain and she knows that I don't, however, it is a price worth paying as the sub-buzz is there long after the pain has gone. While spanking me, she sometimes mentions some minor misdemeanours that I have been guilty of (e.g. leaving the toilet seat up, failing to do a task she asked me to do, etc.), so there is a token punishment gesture added in for good measure. She also has complete freedom to decide how many strokes I get and how hard they should be. I never know what's coming.

So in summary, my girlfriend uses spanking to confirm her power over me and to reinforce my submission. Does that still count as punishment?

 

Great post. This is something I've thought about a lot over the years, and how I would handle it in an FLR. Probably the one thing that I've thought about the most.

I came to the conclusion last year, after spending time on CM reading the vastly different thoughts and motivations of the men here, and a bit of casual / kink dating since, that there is no one-size-fits-all, or even -most solution. Every man has totally different buttons, triggers, subconscious desires and fears. One of the biggest things to sort out from the beginning is if he's a masochist or not, despite what he might even tell you he thinks he is. In my experience, a lot of guys with deeply hidden masochistic or bi tendencies fiercely deny it to themselves, even the super kinky ones. It can take years to surface. I've often had to proceed based on a deeper hunch, or intuition until I have solid proof. A good litmus test is wispering things into his ears while holding his cock and noticing the instant hardening or softening response. Navigating his psyche is a bit of a mine-field and requires careful treading. One guy's dream FLR is another guy's unhappy, unfulfilling prison filled with resentments and results in constant undermining, snide remarks.

For this reason I've decided to keep a very open mind, collect ideas, and tailor punishments around my partner's unique mindset. This can take me months to figure out and requires close attention to how he deals with everyday stuff, how volatile his emotions are, how he reacts to things not going his way, his interactions with the people in his life and his connection with his parents - particularly his mother (unless his father raised him). I cannot go on what he tells me about how he feels about his parents either because most of it is subconscious, but total honesty there and tons of details helps tremendously.

A lot of guys into this lifestyle for years are super keen to jump right in and start things super kinky, close to the start of the relationship. I suppose they want to test to see if she is going to be sexually compatible. But then he is setting the pace, in control of it and it doesn't give her time to completely suss him out. And I've felt rushed in the past and dealt with fallout around that. I think this is where a lot of couples end up in weird or bad discipline habits where he is actually being rewarded for bad and sometimes even heartbreaking behaviour, and so on some level he knows he's the one in control of when he gets rewarded. It can often give guys a cocky attitude and place her in an inferior position in his mind, even if he never admits it. I never want to end up in that kind of FLR and have taken great strides to prevent that happening. I'd rather be in a vanilla relationship than a bad FLR.

It's extremely challenging to be the woman leading an FLR because it requires a ton of imagination and constant analysis and adjustment. Constant novelty. For this reason I've come to the recent realisation that I cannot undertake an FLR long-distance, even if it's just in the beginning. A recent attempt to start an FLR long-distance failed, but taught me a lot. An FLR takes a lot of time to set up and requires daily in-person connection. Its a really challenging and monumental undertaking.

Guys, the most helpful thing you can do for your woman is learn how to delve deep into yourself, learn to know and understand yourself better (even if it takes therapy -- I highly recommend it) and finally learn how to communicate your feelings to her to help her figure you out, so that she doesn't have to be a mind-reader on top of everything else she's doing for you. And be patient as she learns you before expecting her to know how to handle you. Remember, it takes us a lifetime to figure ourselves out, and we're still mostly in the dark.

 

Punishment is complicated. However, we have figured out that in our FLR that physical punishment works well. The FLR gives me the structure that I crave. It has helped eliminate arguments and/or passive aggressive behavior that I previously exhibited when we practiced an "Equal Relationship", and she loves that most of all. I believe that I am inherently more a submissive personality, and she is definitely the more dominant one, so there was no large complication when I proposed she lead the marriage four years ago.

For us, what there was, and still is, is a learning curve for us both. For her, it is learning confidence in her own leadership and also gaining confidence that I will not subvert it. For me, it is learning to release control and accept that things will be okay even if I do not make the decision(s). It has been helpful to both of us that I willingly accept consequences for my poor actions that go against the tenets of our new FLR. In this light, physical discipline has been very beneficial for both of us.

For her, I believe that she enjoys having a physical method of exhibiting her disappointment or anger at something I have said or done. I sense that she experiences some true release of emotion and allows herself to forgive me after she has had the opportunity to punish me. As her confidence has grown, her initial few hand swats has evolved into much more severe punishment sessions. She has seen a positive response from setting and enforcing her boundaries and rules. We have a "No Exceptions, No Excuses Policy" for a number of things and she has seen a great growth from me by asserting her control over those rules.

For me, I know that I feel as though I have paid a price and offered her penance by accepting her punishment. I do feel absolved, and it is much easier for me to move on after being punished for wronging her. By consistently staying with "No Exceptions, No Excuses" my snarkiness has been reduced and nearly eliminated. I feel better about it, and I know that she does as well.

She has gone as far as initiating Weekly Maintenance sessions. These initially began quite light, but she has now escalated them to the point that each week I am reminded a little of what actual punishment for her can actually feel like. This too has been helpful for the both of us.

Even when the sessions were "light", the mere act of preparing myself, and the room, for "Maintenance" has been good for me. It is quite humbling to be told to go prepare for maintenance; to disrobe, to set up the bed pillows to elevate my ass, to arrange the paddles and straps that she will choose from, to kneel naked waiting for her to come in, to thank her for accepting my submissiveness, and to thank her for understanding I need her to lead. All of these activities reinforce my agreed upon position within our marriage. I love that she gives me this weekly dose of humility and weekly dunking into a very submissive role.

For her, she tells me she feels good after delivering maintenance. She likes the reinforcement of her new role as the leader of our relationship. She enjoys my submissive nature, and loves that I readily submit to something she wants to do. After a punishment session, she has told me that she feels more relaxed and relieved that she had the final word, and that she is happy with the outcome of a more contrite and compliant husband.

Punishment is complicated. But, like with anything else complicated, the more we participate, the more we have learned what works for us and what doesn't. It was difficult for her to start, she was reticent and tentative, but she tells now that, like with our FLR, she will never go back. We certainly have not figured it all out, but what we have figured out is we are happier than ever.

 

What a lovely testimonial. Thank you very much for sharing that and showing just how loving a relationship can be in an FLR, and how much understanding and communication needs to play a role.

It can be very nice, and has been, to read of such a loving and successful story.

 

We have maintenance sessions too which is more of a regular display of her dominance weekly, and punishment is separate from that. i dont write things I do down because im not a needy child acting out for her attention nor am I incapable of being a person. We do the joking If you dont mow the lawn ill paddle you, I joke no im tired this afternoon, she sends me outside with a stinging tingly butt and says she will make me tired if im a good boy and finishes before shes out of the shower, or a whipping for motivation to get up and I need help with things like working out during the week with her whipping my butt, because when I finger her my arm gets tired too quickly lmao. If theres a "reason" its never a real reason that a person would be punished for, and if I step out of line Id more likely be told to do some chores We do this to make our life another level better, not to make our relationship work at a base level. If we breakup id be devastated losing my love not losing my dom.

Like the OP my KeyH doesnt punish me with things I like. I rarely get punished corporally for things she isnt stupid and knows it makes me subbie, that I like being subbie and that ill chase the feeling. I like maintenance making me feel subbie and cuddling with her hand against my shaved head. We rolepplay but mostly? When I get spanked and whipped its because she likes it! It isnt a punishment for us to do things that is traditionally a punishment in 'vanilla' (hate that) life. Just like Calibob though (cool name =P) maintenance has helped subbie me and dom her grow into their roles more realistically and passionately and why I never am anxious she will walk away from it or Ill have to play the online fantasy trap Im seeing on forums (the real Dot Com Crisis hehehe)

 

Think it's very true and hit it directly on the nail. As you say many times subs seek to know if they are compatible. Instead of chill and get to know each other not just kink. For one person something is punishment for another the same thing is a reward. In general, I think it's important to listen to each other but that the woman sets the pace at the end of the day.

 

This is a very true statement for us. I'd take it a step further and say enduring the punishment once your fight or flight instinct kicks in really takes this to another level. This has happened several times in my relationship where I stayed put even though the pain was more than I could stand.

I've come to terms that I don't like punishments, but I need punishments for this reason. It is a raw expression of dominance that I simply don't experience in other ways. Last night my wife had me rub deep blue on her back to ease some lower back pain. When I was done I got up and walked towards the bathroom to wash my hands. She ordered me to stop and asked me if I'd forgotten something. I looked around and then the realization hit home that I'd forgotten to arm the alarm system. I apologized at once for the mistake. She told me to rub the deep blue onto my balls to remind me to be more careful in the future. I did as instructed and spent the next 20 minutes doing my personal version of great balls of fire.

There was nothing I liked about the chemical ball burning. Yet I adore and respect her for having the strength and control over me to inflict that. This is what punishment is for me.

 

A little maintenance goes a long way...

 

Yeppers.
Communication both ways is everything, and as a sub being aware of Her and what she is feeling and allowing her to "set the pace" as you say, is the key to success.
All good things will follow.