Permanent chastity? Indefinite? Lifestyle? Sealed? Got any other terms you like or hate?

Hmmm. OK E/B might need tuning up.

Or perhaps this needs a scale.

 

This is getting silly.....I like it...though I'm getting really confused. Tom! Giles! Can one of you summarise please?

 

Good idea...

FOR THOSE WHO'VE JUST TUNED IN​

Tom and I are trying to come up with a value neutral way to describe the different chastity practices. His C/D scale is useful, but doesn't prompt us to consider the way the chastity works, e.g. he and I spend similar periods chaste and denied but for Tom and Mrs Edge it's about her owning his cock, whereas for Xena and I, it's about neutering-lite

So I've evolved a second matrix:

​

TEST 1: "Locked by...."
You are "Locked by Keyholder" unless lockup periods could be automated.

• Locked by Keyholder: Keyholder typically has the key and controls the lockup as they see fit.
• Locked by Rule: Rules control the lockup. These rules may have established by a keyholder, but could in theory be automated, e.g. "Locked until she comes 100 times", "locked for 100 days", "locked as much as possible".

TEST 2: "About..."
Lockup is "About Enduring Chastity" if the keyholder takes an interest in your release and is engaged with any resulting orgasms. Otherwise lockup is "About Being In Chastity".

• About Enduring Chastity: Chastity is something to be endured, typically in the hope of release. Release is the light at the end of the tunnel, even if it keeps receding. "Lol, if you are a good boy I might release you this month!"
  
• About Being in Chastity: Chastity is the default state and the wearer is resigned to this, and has incorporated it into his identity, though still suffers. "Lol, perhaps I'll keep you locked all year."

This approach is potentially useful because it prompts us to think about how the relationship works, or how the relationship with chastity works.

For example, a Keyholder style dominant wants a key, and doesn't tend to work with dice games and timer safes etc. However, in Rule style, the dominant may find a key a lot of extra fuss and be very happy to automate lockup timings, or switch to a permanent device.

The main issue is illustrated by @homebody's contribution: like Newtonian physics near a star, this system breaks when lockup periods are short and it's hard to tell what's going on.

 

I believe I'd be firmly in the R/B category. My wife has little to no interest in any of the mechanical aspects of chastity--neither cage nor the key. She'd consider any of that a chore. I doubt she'd care if someone else held the proverbial key. HOWEVER, she strongly prefers the default condition of me being locked. She simply likes me better this way. At best she has a vague idea that some sort of cleaning and maintenance needs to get done.

If there was the perfect (for me) device, it'd never come off.

 

I understand and agree with the point of this thread, essentially to develop a categorization of why and how we experience our chastity and denial, but I'm not sure the category descriptions clearly describe it, at least for me. My comments are in CAPITAL ITALICS

TEST 1: "Locked by...."
You are "Locked by Keyholder" unless lockup periods could be automated.

• Locked by Keyholder: Keyholder typically has the key and controls the lockup as they see fit. IN OUR CASE, MY WIFE CONTROLS WHEN I MAY BE RELEASED FOR USE, BUT DOESN'T WANT THE KEY OR TO BE INVOLVED IN DAILY OR WEEKLY ISSUES LIKE RELEASE FOR CLEANING. BUT THERE ARE NO PRESET RULES, SO I'M IN THIS CATEGORY. PERHAPS AMEND THE DESCRIPTION?
• Locked by Rule: Rules control the lockup. These rules may have established by a keyholder, but could in theory be automated, e.g. "Locked until she comes 100 times", "locked for 100 days", "locked as much as possible".

TEST 2: "About..."
Lockup is "About Enduring Chastity" if the keyholder takes an interest in your release and is engaged with any resulting orgasms. Otherwise lockup is "About Being In Chastity". THIS ONE IS UNCLEAR TO ME. CHASTITY IS MY DEFAULT STATE, BUT IT'S WRONG TO SAY I'M "RESIGNED" TO THIS. I WILLINGLY WEAR MY CHASITY DEVICE BECAUSE IT IS BETTER FOR US, SO AM I IN OR OUT OF THE "ABOUT BEING IN CHASTITY" CATEGORY? BUT I ALSO CONTINUALLY HOPE FOR RELEASE AND SHE GRANTS RELEASE FOR HER PURPOSES, SO AM A "ENDURING" CHASTITY? IF THE KEY DIFFERENTIATING POINT HERE IS WHETHER "THE KEYHOLDER TAKES AN INTEREST IN YOUR RELEASE" ARE WE CONFLATING THIS "ABOUT" CATEGORY WITH THE "LOCKED BY KEYHOLDER" TEST IN TEST 1? WOULD A BETTER DESCRIPTION OF THESE CATEGORIES BE "RELEASE FOR SEXUAL INTIMACY AND RELOCKING IS PART OF CHASTITY" AND "RELEASE IS NEITHER EXPECTED NOR NORMAL AND THE WEARER HAS FORFEITED INTIMATE SEXUAL EXPECTATIONS"?

• About Enduring Chastity: Chastity is something to be endured, typically in the hope of release. Release is the light at the end of the tunnel, even if it keeps receding. "Lol, if you are a good boy I might release you this month!"
  
• About Being in Chastity: Chastity is the default state and the wearer is resigned to this, and has incorporated it into his identity, though still suffers. "Lol, perhaps I'll keep you locked all year."

 

@Rectrix, if there was a "love" button instead of a "like", I'd have pressed that.

This is a fantastic discussion. The Philosophy of Chastity. What a worthy topic! And our professors are excellent.

 

Thanks for contributing! Yes the wording needs tweaking.

It sounds to me as if there is a Rule: "you are locked up and denied as much as possible except when she wants sex". If so this breaks my automation test.

Now as to what the chastity is about... you present an interesting example.

First of all, for you, clearly Chastity is something you "Endure". It's a wild rollercoaster ride.

However, it sounds as if she just likes you chaste, except when she wants certain kinds of intimacy. That feels as if, from her point of view, it puts you in the "Being" category.

So

• This category clearly needs to be able to reflect mismatched experiences.
• Endure/Being needs a better test around.

Hmmmm

 

I see myself in the Locked/Endure category, same as Tom, albeit for different reasons. I think you can end up in these categories not just by your own design but also by hers.

 

Yes. One thing about what I like to call female focussed femdom is that our kicks often arrive as a byproduct. Our dominant's experience may not be complimentary to ours.

 

So, 6 months into "permanent" chastity, a significant either/or parameter has occurred to me:

Sentence: Passage of time increases the chance of release
vs
Open Ended: Passage of time has no effect on the chance of release​

And yes, I'm sure there is better wording.

In Sentence Chastity, the longer you are locked, the greater the pressure on your keyholder to release you. At some point your keyholder will say something like "OK, 2 months is enough." They may do this upfront, or review your lockup from time to time.

Psychologically, you experience time as moving you toward eventual release.

This style has a "Typical Sentence", e.g. 1 month.

In Open Ended Chastity, each day is a new start. Your keyholder's feelings about releasing you are unaffected by how long you've been locked. At some point, they may say, "Right, I want you unlocked" but that could happen tomorrow or next year. The dice have no memory.

Psychologically, you experience chastity as indefinite. There's no "eventually", only "one-day".

This style has a "Half-Life", that is: if there were 100 of you, how much time would have to elapse before 50 of you were free?

It probably also has: a "Lead-In", the time you'll definitely spend locked before a Half-Life applies, the equivalent of building up to cruising speed; and a "Wind-Down", the expected waiting period after your keyholder decides you will be unlocked.

So in my case, I think I have a Lead-In of 1 year. After that, I estimate a Half-Life of 12 months. I think the Wind-Down is likely to be 6 months, as in Xena will randomly decide we're reaching the end of the experience, but is unlikely to order my immediate release.

Perhaps the Wind-Down period is the most significant sub parameter, because it means, until told otherwise, I will always have at least another 6 months ahead of me - a bit like cold fusion.

 

I would use the term indefinite. I am locked up until she decides to remove it and I don't cum unless she wants me to and only how she wants me to. Typically, after she is done with it, whatever she decides to do with it, it will go right back on. At this point I will deep clean the device, trim up and wash before putting it back on.
Our arrangement is that she may want it off at any point or never again, completely up to her.
And I/we love it that way!
Obviously any health related/hygiene related reasons my force our hand, after all it is a game even if it is our lifestyle.

 

@Giles_English
Yes, a Chastity Sentence is a definitely bounded time period. Passage of time gets you closer to the end. You can count down to the date if you know it. You can count up to.

Indefinite is a good word.
Unbounded or boundless is descriptive.

My chastity has no lower limit. I might be let out at any time. She could use a K-Safe to give herself up to a 10 day cool down time, and lock herself out from removing my cage.

My chastity as no upper limit. She said 100 years but that’s not helpful.

I do think in mathematical terms.
timeNow+(lower limit, upper limit)
greater than signs.. less than signs…

My wife tells me it would be better if I don’t try to count. She does prefer completely indefinite. There is only timeNow.

 

Yes, I think that's the crux of it.

 

I like the term “perpetual”. It’s “always around” but not necessarily perfectly permanent.

One common definition of perpetual is “occurring repeatedly; so often as to seem endless or uninterrupted.”

If you feel your chastity is “perpetual” that is permanent enough.

“Perpetual Chastity”. Who doesn’t want that?

 

Yes, I call it "perpetual".

 

Chastity starts as a kink. Hence the words permenent chastity is a turn on. Taken literally, that can be dangerous as discussed plenty of times.
I admit I still get excited over the word/thought. But to me FULL TIME chastity fits it better. Your always in chastity except when your not, her decision or life experiences.
In a perfect world, weld that puppy up. But life gets in the way. Age works against you in this world. At 20 years old DR visits hardly existed. At 50, they become a way too common occurence.
FULL TIME is not as exciting as PERMENENT. But the purpose is still the same.

 

Anyone can use a word anyway they like within reason, provided they can offer clarity by further explaination.

Permanence is not necessarily forever. You can have a permanent job for instance, but then something changes and you end up temping or back in another permanent situation.

 

Well, that certainly puts a new spin on being classified as a FTE. You get 15 days of PTO every year. Your boss has to approve it, though.

 

We use the term “Full Time”. She decides when, why, and how long releases occur. Otherwise, I am locked.

 

My wife and I, always explain it with permanent chastity, because most people can imagine something under that. The exact form, however, is different for each constellation of couples.

To describe it in terms of "us", that's how it went, as it almost always does, that I was interested in it. So the one who ends up with the cage on his dick.

My wife was willing to try it out and in the beginning we always just called it "playing", which we still like to do today.

It was when she realised the advantages for herself that she really started to take control. So it's no longer that we use it to have sex afterwards, but to consciously use the horniness "against me".

So while it was clear beforehand that I would be "free" again after a week or two, or after the weekend, it was no longer in my hands afterwards.

It has remained that way until today, and no, we did NOT talk about it beforehand.

A big difference we noticed compared to other couples. My wife presents me with a fait accompli.

"You stay locked and I'll unlock you when I feel like it!"

After that, she started making up rules with me, so while I already didn't have a key in my hand and the piercing clearly prevented me from getting my penis out of the cage on my own.

This developed into a journey where I get unlocked every now and then, but that doesn't mean I could orgasm without her being present.

Since we live together 24/7 and the only time we don't see each other is when I'm at work, but since the cage prevents access, it's a very seamless surveillance.

So is this permament now? In the sense of matrices, rules and ideas that are developed by other people?

Due to the actions of my wife in the last few days, I currently have the cage off and "only" an glans cage mounted, as the testicle has developed bruises at the bottom.

I "could" masturbate now by holding a vibrator on it, but my wife would notice.

But I don't want to!

On the one hand, because of a possible punishment afterwards and on the other hand, because I want to be there for her and that also means waiting until she thinks I can cum.

So our permanent chastity is more a promise and dedication to her.

Because even without a cage, I don't do it without her permission.

So it's not really about blocking the penis from access, but about changing your inner attitude.

And that starts with the fact that I can watch porn, captions and other things for hours without feeling the need to touch myself.

But when she says look at it and jerk off, I get a hard-on almost immediately.

And that has developed over the years that we have been together. No "femdom", no "FLR" or anything else, but that we know each other so well that she notices without words when it's too much and ensures relaxation, just as I notice it with her immediately.

Cage, games, rules, clothes and "trying out new things" are simply decorative accessories that can be very horny and hot, but they don't have to be.

Thus I, for my part at least, define permament with the fact that one has changed one's "mind". That one no longer perceives sex as a given constant and self-determined activity, but as one that one either carries out together or allowed alone and possibly supervised.

 

I was in a “permanent chastity” head space from October 2020 through July 2021. She in very real and believable terms. She made me believe I’d “never again” get to stroke my cock. She was pressing thoughts of permanent PIV denial into my brain, and encouraging me to let go and be comfortable living with that expectation.

I did learn… I spent the first 6 months of 2021 in near 100% chastity. She broke my orgasm denial record without mentioning it. I sort of floated past that milestone. So that worked.

For various reasons I broke down in July. Maybe it’s because she let me out to give me two orgasms that month.

She had only given me three orgasms in size months: one on New Years Day with the expectation it would be my last one for the year. And two bracketing her long trip overseas to manage my brain. Not for my pleasure as much as to ensure I was a good boy for her.

Otherwise I breezed through constant caged denial. And she started discussing letting me stay caged for doctor’s visits. She let me get massages caged. No more excuses.

I wish I hadn’t broken down.
But it was “permanent” until we broke it.
I was sad to have done so.

Now I’m back in chastity full time because it’s best for me. It’s become a part of me.

We aren’t pushing on promises of permanence right now. It remains my fantasy. But I lived in the headspace of that expectation for 12 months.

What we were lacking is other kinds of sex. Without her letting me out for ruined orgasms, I craved to be pegged, or to use a strapon to fuck her, or cunnilingus, or something. That’s something we need to resolve.

Sex is something I need, even if penile stimulation and my orgasms aren’t important or necessary. I enjoy staying caged and denied.

My Permanent chastity is something she’d accept, if I could float and not flail.
Otherwise “constant” “full time” are good words.

She enjoys the word “indefinite”
When she pressed on “never again” and “permanent” denial I started to panic. I tried to live with it but the lack of replacing penile stimulation with other forms of sex, I ended up breaking and cracking that permanence.

 

Bingo.

 

love this, perfectly put in my HO.