Is tease and denial the right message to be giving out?

Discussion in 'Chastity and orgasm denial' started by L-u-c-y, Nov 27, 2016.

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  1. PuellaPurpurea
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    I respectfully disagree. This is a public forum. The males are not "in charge" here any more than anyone else, and I certainly haven't seen the most prolific male posters here telling women how to behave.

    There are femdom websites out there in which the dominant women most definitely take control of the content. That's all well and good. You could even say there's a sort of low-level roleplaying going on, where the femdom dynamic is played up for all users' further enjoyment.

    The Mansion is not one of these. It does not cast itself as a site where people are expected to conform to the femdom narrative for the sake of the content, to "stay in character" as it were. It is a forum where people are encouraged to discuss the chastity lifestyle, whether in character or out of character. To take your example of a parallel site for male doms and female subs, it would be like a support forum for all the female subs to chat and share advice and experiences. What's wrong with that?

    I specifically wasn't going to touch this one, but if you insist...

    Yes, he is, in my opinion. He may not be explicitly offering them a good or service, but in a sense, he is "giving" those subs what they want: the experience of serving a dominant male.

    The free market is all about exchange for mutual benefit. People make a trade of goods or services when it would increase the utility (happiness/fulfilment/quality of life) of both parties. Your relationships with your subs are of this nature, simply by virtue of the fact that they aren't doing it against their will. This isn't Ancient Rome. These guys choose to be your subs and enjoy being your subs, for whatever reason that may be. They give you service, and in return, they get the emotional satisfaction of being your sub. You don't have to "give" them anything for there to be some kind of exchange going on.

    Now, your point about doing all this for your own fun and satisfaction, rather than for theirs, is perfectly valid. You like what you have going on, and that's great! However, I don't think that technically precludes this being an exchange. Again, an exchange is made for mutual benefit. You shouldn't have to not enjoy it for it to be an exchange. That's silly.

    You certainly don't have to call what you do a business or service if you don't want to. Heck, maybe it's better not to, if you want to emphasize your position of power and stress that you're not explicitly giving them any obvious good or service. As I've said, this is largely semantics, and I don't know why we're still arguing about it. But regardless of what you call it, there IS an exchange going on: their service for the satisfaction of serving. You don't have to "give" them anything for them to get the satisfaction out of it.
     
  2. L-u-c-y
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    He's allowing them to serve him, not offering them a service.
     
  3. SubVerity
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    SubVerity Still the mansion's fairy godmother. ;)

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    But they want to serve him. They came to him and said "Please may we serve you?"

    In allowing them to serve him, he is appeasing their desire to serve, thus he performs a service for them.

    But it is semantics. Service is a reciprocal thing. As long as it's between consenting adults it is anyway.
     
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  4. L-u-c-y
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    He isn't doing to for them, he's doing it for himself.
     
  5. SubVerity
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    SubVerity Still the mansion's fairy godmother. ;)

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    But it doesnt matter what his intention is. The fact that a service is done in some way, is independent of intent.
     
  6. PuellaPurpurea
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    This. Because we live in a society where slavery is illegal, the only way for a stable master/slave relationship to exist is between consenting adults. And if the sub consents to being a sub, then he/she is presumably, to some extent, pleased to be a sub. That means that the dom, even if purely selfishly motivated, is pleasing the sub by simply being a dom...and thus, perhaps unintentionally or inadvertently, "doing the sub a service."
     
  7. L-u-c-y
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    Doing the sub a favour is different than offering a service.
     
  8. PuellaPurpurea
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    I never said you were explicitly offering them any services (you clearly aren't), just that you were inadvertently giving them one.

    I'm not arguing with the way you do things. As I said earlier, since you aren't vocally offering your subs anything, you don't have to call your shtick a business or service. You do you, babe. I was simply pointing out that the pleasure of servitude is an implicit factor, thus making the interaction technically an exchange. That's all it is. Semantics.
     
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  9. HollyC
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    HollyC Active member

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    Lucy, I think that's incredibly unfair to the current administrator of CM.

    When CM went offline and was facing extinction, Jens was the only one who stepped in with the monthly cash to get it on its feet again and continues to pay that to this day. It's all well and good calling for female ownership but what if none of us have the cash available! Perhaps you do - or don't - a question people on this thread seem obsessively intrigued with lol. All I know is that without Jens CM would not be online.

    Jen's current project is making the site more female friendly. I suggest you discuss your genuine ideas with him. I'm sure he'd be keen to hear them. But please don't call it 'crazy' for him to be the Admin. As for the rest of the 'men in charge' i.e. the male moderators, and whether they deserve a role: it was actually they that leapt to your defence on this particular topic.
     
  10. L-u-c-y
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    I wasn't talking about Jens, I was talking about the vibe given by the members. It would be interesting know how many of the 29,000 members are female.
     
  11. HollyC
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    HollyC Active member

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    My mistake. When you said 'males in charge' - I assumed you were referring to the males in charge.
     
  12. L-u-c-y
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    I said "When you think about it it's crazy to have males in charge". I didn't offer an alternative :)
     
  13. SubVerity
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    SubVerity Still the mansion's fairy godmother. ;)

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    The phrase 'Pee or get off the pot' comes to mind. :)

    But it would certainly be interesting to know how many members are female, and it would be interesting to know how many members never post.
    WhIle it's true that Jens has a long term project to make CM all about FLR, I have a hunch that it will only ever really be about male chastity, with a bit of FLR taking centre stage like some grand-diva walking on in the 3rd act swathed in black feather boas, whips and paddles.
     
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  14. Shimone
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    Shimone Long term member

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    Interesting thread.

    While I think that Lucy migth be right to some degree that at least in the internet quite a lot (wannabe) subs seem to think that a FLR is most about fullfilling their fantasies only I tend to disagree with everything else.

    Taken literally this might work in the web (don't know as I don't have any experience with online keyholding and I am not into chastity for it's own sake anyway), but it won't do for sure in the real thing. What you describe is a one way road and this will not work in any relationship - not even a FLR. In a FLR it might be the common decision that he will follow her rule and that she will be the center of relationship. But neverthe less - even if he has to follow her decision in most parts of the relationship his own needs have to be met, too. Thereby it doesn't matter if you say they are met as a favour or a service...

    Speaking about the term service: Maybe it is somewhat more common in the internet, because online keyholding is probable mostly done by professionals - offering a service for money...
     
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  15. Kate Medova
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    Kate Medova (not really)

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    Confession. I couldn't be arsed to read the whole thread. If it has moved on significantly from the original post and some of the earlier vitriol feel free to ignore or discard my post.

    In response to Mistress Lucy's original post. Any persons interest in chastity is about whatever they want it to be about. There are no rights or wrongs. I do suspect that, on this site, it is mostly driven by those that get a sexual kick out of it. I do. Does teasing have to be involved? That gets (a qualified) not for me. For others it may. Speaking for myself only - I enjoy chastity for all or any of the following reasons; it denies a basic and incredibly strong animal desire; that desire increases as denial goes on; it can be a surrendering of control; it can be a submission to the will of another; it can out of respect to another; and many other things.

    It does not have to be sexual but obviously can be. I get a sexual kick out of being denied a release but I can also get a deep emotional satisfaction when I submit to another. That relinquishment of control is so very calming it is really beyond description.

    In response to the comments on Mistress Lucy's drivers in this area I would say...FFS. She is obviously not operating a commercial enterprise here is she? (Barely) covering her costs to buy and send locks must pale into insignificance when you consider how she could be spending her time productively otherwise. Get a grip people. I wouldn't go to the trouble she does. Not that there is any demand for me to...Obviously.
     
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  16. CanuckSnowman
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    Do you hold the key to a lock for a device around their genitals? Do you tell them you'll send it to them upon their agreed completed time or tasks? They must perform tasks or serve time in order to appease you. They do it because they have a desire to do so. They want it. If they didn't want it, their services would be moot and you'd have no one. If you didn't do what they are wanting, or looking for, your services would be moot and they'd move on.

    No matter how you want to try to twist it. They serve you. You serve them. Suck it up and move on trying to squirm out of a definition you want to re-define.
     
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  17. L-u-c-y
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    Incorrect. I do what I want if they are involved or not. I did the same thing before I knew of subs and I will do the same thing if I have no subs.
     
  18. CanuckSnowman
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    Without a "sub"...you have nothing. No matter what you try to tell yourself, we all know its a "service" both ways...have a good day.
     
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  19. L-u-c-y
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    I don't care if I don't have any subs...
     
  20. kevinp
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    kevinp New member

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    She loses nothing by having no subs.
     
  21. Thatguyontheinternet
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    Thatguyontheinternet Owned by Thatgirl

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    @PuellaPurpurea @HollyC @CanuckSnowman @SubVerity

    Be careful with the kind of plain and obvious logic you've all displayed in these lasts messages of yours. Young lucy doesn't respond well to that. I learnt that well after an agonizing hour spent responding to her as nicely as possible, humoring her in every way in attempt to get her to give an inch. To admit that 2+2 is 4.

    The kind of denial of basic logic statements she displays in this thread is something one generally only sees in a teenager whose primary objective is to be oppositionally defiant, rather than to actually listen to and absorb your points.

    Which makes sense. I hadn't realized how young she is (and young for her age as well, IMO). And yes, when combined with the reality that her "experience" in any of this is entirely virtual, it does matter). Once I was told, it all started to make sense and I stopped responding, having not even read her latest reply, knowing it would show no greater sign of her having actually considered what I'd said than the 100 previous flippant (and devoid of any sign of having even read them) responses of hers to other member's undeniably logical points.

    So I began to consider the source further: This person IS who/what she derides. Her view of "proper" chastity is as internally manufactured as the single men whose desires vis-a-vis chastity she mocks as the product of online fantasy and selfishness. As if her "online" "experience" is somehow more right than theirs. She is simply the mirror image of them. Identical in lack of real life, flesh and blood experience. Which ordinarily would be fine. Except in her case she conducts herself with the overconfidence and brazen tuning-out of basic reasoning akin only to a teenage girl slamming the door in the face of mum in response to a well made, irrefutable point.

    How long will the adults in this forum continue to bang their heads against the wall in this thread trying to eek even the slightest concession to logic - to dictionary definitions for gods sake - from this girl? Does not her inability to, one time in 16 pages, say "yes, well of course that makes sense and I understand what your saying, but my point nonetheless is..." say something important about her?

    That and she's a big poopy face.

    I'm out!
     
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  22. SubVerity
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    SubVerity Still the mansion's fairy godmother. ;)

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    While varying amounts of what @Thatguyontheinternet says is true, Lucy is an original, one of a kind, ploughing her own furrow kind of CM member, and CM is all the better for having her as she raises other views, and ways of being.

    Rather than sit and point out failings, why not just appreciate what is good?
    Failings, we all have, they're nothing new, and they're very subjective.
    If we all just pointed out each other's failings this place wouldn't work. And in fact to do so is rather rude.
    Far better to sit back and enjoy people's differences and foibles, and rather pointless to expect not to have any. I'm sure you have your own.
     
  23. SubVerity
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    SubVerity Still the mansion's fairy godmother. ;)

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    Btw, saying "I'm out" on a thread is a bit like flouncing out of a room when everyone knows you'll be back in a bit with "and another thing..."

    You know it's true. :)
     
  24. L-u-c-y
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    I have met around 20 subs from various fetish sites, there are reports from these on my profiles on other sites (which you claim to have read).

    When I first got involved with chastity I arranged to meet a few and have them lock themselves in front of me, they all stood me up.

    You've admitted you skimmed through this thread, you haven't taken much notice of it at all, hence your mistake with the charity thing amongst others.
     
  25. L-u-c-y
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