Did the Victorians have it right?

@asimpleman23 not@simpleman23. Such a blunder has now altered the whole of the future and the past in this contest between conformity and rebellion...

 

No. The Victorians were completely bonkers when it came to sex and sexuality.

 

There is a massive difference between choosing a chaste life and having it forced upon you. There is an even bigger problem when the forcing has been done for a misreading of a religious text. To stigmatize something that is obviously natural and brings pleasure is the sin, not the act itself.

I am not denying that for some people masturbation becomes problematic, but to deny it to the majority because of the addiction of a minority is plain wrong.

 

Sins of emission, good one @Achedlock17!

 

No doubt. They will laugh out how we still thought masturbation was a sin.

I am not arguing that masturbation is not sometimes wrong. I am not arguing that masturbation isn’t a problem for some people. I am not arguing that masturbation doesn’t cause issues in a relationship. I am not going to deny that since I stopped masturbating and my Wife took control of the key to my chastity device my relationship with her has improved immensely.

I am saying that viewing masturbation as a sin, which is what the Victorians explicitly did, is wrong, damaging, and the methods used to curtail masturbation were barbaric.

 

You can't be that naive. They're not asking you to help them with their "addiction." You're literally feeding it by providing them with fodder for a different kind of fantasy. There may be one or two who're legitimately interested in overcoming an addiction, but the vast majority of them are just looking for something else to play with. lol

 

I have a double interest in this because I've read up on Victorian sexual attitudes - they pretty much invented the male chastity belt - and because I've been unable to masturbate now for over six months.

The Victorians were clearly bonkers and often evil in their extreme attitude to masturbation, based as it was on pseudo science, with rubbish about "preserving the precious seed" and so on. And obviously, this was driven by dodgy entrepreneurs and sadists who wanted to sell you a "cure" or hack away at your privates or those of your offspring (in particular, some of the stories about cures for female masturbation are utterly horrifying).

However, I think the historic and perhaps instinctive ambivalence about masturbation stems from the fact that it's a substitute activity. If it's your main sexual outlet, then you're not engaging with real world sexuality, and perhaps not even real world people.

At the base level, if your response to feeling horny is always to jerk off, rather than to seek or improve your sex life, then your life isn't going to improve.

Then we come to the porno internet. I don't think porn in itself is actually a problem. Rational experts will tell you it can actually make you a better more pleasure seeking lover. If vanilla porn fosters unrealistic expectations, then that's more an issue with early sex education, not the porn.

However, having a fetish tends to foster loneliness and private gratification, setting up a feedback loop, and that's where porn can be a problem, especially for certain kinds of men that treat the entire kinky internet as interactive porn - I think Lucy has a thread of their messages. I'm not sure it's an addiction so much as a trap. Not being able to masturbate, breaks out of that trap by breaking the feedback loop.

Open ended chastity is very much a by product of our power exchange relationship - chastity is a fetish for both of us. However, I can see that it has improved my life. I spend much less time online gathering images for my masturbation slideshows, and no longer waste time tinkering with unfinishable erotica projects. I'm also fully engaged with the here and now with my wife. I work harder to keep the spark in our relationship, rather than letting things slide, and get more of an erotic kick out of our every intimacy.

Couldn't I just use willpower? Well for a start, willpower is less fun. However, even without the kink, using chastity to break a bad habit around porn and masturbation is no different than going to a health retreat to get away from booze and fags, or unhealthy food. The idea is to build new patterns of living that are more sustainable. Once you have those established, then the willpower can come into play.

 

I see where you are coming from (pun?) here but wanted to ask whether in your opinion jerking off to e.g. the chastity caption photos in the CM gallery is a form of improving my sex life in the following scenarios:

1. if that were my only engagement with the Mansion
2. if as well as that I create threads; post replies etc.

I'm in category 2, so I am engaging with the sexual world, or at least, this part of that world

 

Sorry, I didn't mean to sound judgemental - was sharing a thought really.

(I should also have said that it's OK if porn is also your coping mechanism when for practical reasons you can't be yourself in RL - whether or not this applies to you.)

Since you ask..

It depends!

If #1 means diving in for a quick wank to a fantasy and getting on with your life, that's normal healthy porn use.

If #2 means exploring the feelings and practicalities around chastity with a view to doing it, then that's also good.

If #2 is really just interactive/collaborative porn, unless it's a coping mechanism, then you're putting a lot of time an effort into living something online which might be better explored in RL.

 

Thanks for your reply. We are all always-already being judgmental, and btw I don’t mind being judged negatively () although I’m not addicted to that either! I think I’m in a category 2c, if you have identified 2a and 2b above. Category 2c is {2a &2b} with added philosophy. In fact I’m more interested in the philosophy- as my status says I find the Mansion functions as an X Ray machine for my broader philosophical interests. In turn the philosophy is folded into my engagement with the broader social world (not the other way around, which would be flying solo...).

My perspective is that chastity is a striking crucible to analyse the contemporary predominance of sex and enjoyment; whether I’d ever have the balls to get locked IRL is an open question but the idea titillates me...

 

I think chastity fetishists get off more on situation than explicit content. So...

 

So what have you learned? I'm fascinated now...

 

Much of what interests me philosophically seems to be exemplified by the political implications of the intense chastity relationships I read about in CM. Given that locking it up is not our natural state, and in fact is the opposite of that natural state, then assuming there is no coercion something approaching a political miracle has occurred: the male’s mind has been changed!

Affected males have had their original frame on reality (Equality might be the strapline of this reality) disrupted sufficiently (negatived by the effect on them of their female dominant+ the negative marking of their sex drive) and have then negated that first negation by entering a new frame on reality constituted by their agreement to a FLR/KH arrangement (strapline inequality). The condition of possibility of the new, unequal frame is that it is...unequal. That is, in theory there is no experience in the new unequal reality that could “make one think again and want to go back”, no matter how bad that experience could be. It’s just the way the world is now: it’s a FLR world now and what she wants she gets.

The chastity captions making it clear that the locking is forever or at least indefinite...they have to be interpreted by the male who is locked as not negative otherwise the only reason to carry on is coercion which leads to the position of the victim in a standard coercive and controlling relationship (which is a criminal offence in the UK).

So the locked male’s evaluation of chastity has assimilated a negative marking of his sex drive and has participated in a redirection of that negatively marked sex drive in a way to suit his partner-but also in a way that is satisfying for the male. Such an outcome is political dynamite! Replicated on a societal scale it would remake the world!

 

(replied on your journal)

 

More more please! That was so arousing to think of all the horny, sexually frustrated men walking around carrying such full testicles regularly.