A paradox

Yes Miss LUCY we seem to see that a lot. I want to change my wife to be my Keyholder and Dom but they don’t want to change.

I’ve been down this road and it’s a slow journey waiting for someone to change to a different lifestyle, if they even want to change anything. In our situation I served her Unconditionally for a long long time because I wanted to please her. She loved what I did for her than and still does now.

If you want to make your wife happy by serving her than do it. What happens after that is under her control. I was lucky and Miss Shelly wanted to take on a more controlling role of our life others may not.

 

Yes, chastity is not needed to serve or make her happy. Learn and do these things first then see what happens.

 

The thing that Chastity can help with is helping to control our habit of masterbation. Everyone knows a person is a better servant before an orgasm than right after. The cage can help to make it inconvenient to play with your self. The serving is difficult when she doesn’t seem to be returning the favour, but this is when you need to look at Why you want to do things to please her is it for your benefit or here’s. If you want something out of it than your whole idea of serving her is wrong. The Unconditional Serving is very important and difficult for someone to do. The inner feeling of knowing she is happier should be enough to motivate you.

 

not easy to make keyholder(not comercial)...i got 3 straight years to convince her to be keyholder,so many arguing, debating, etc
so yes i change not to push her much, and i want to change myself, care for her, give her more oral, give her more orgasm, etc
love her first...

 

This seems to hit the nail on the head for me. Not sure it could be stated much better.

 

Exactly Lucy, as you know I have made this point before too.

"I am submissive but I want my wife to change to accommodate my desire for chastity "
Cognitive dissonance!

In my view it's a simple question of priority.
Which is more important? Making the wife happy & serving her, or your wearing a device?
For a submissive it should be simple, your wife is sovereign in all things.
She may accede to your wishes and give you what you desire, or she may not.
That is, simply, part and parcel of submission. A chastity device is not.

 

I think a big part of this issue is that the people wanting to introduce this to their partners have often been interested in chastity or fantasised about it for a very long time. When it comes to getting their wives into it they try to run before they can walk. I imagine that could be quite a lot for the poor wife/girlfriend to take in... Especially if it's presented out of the blue and comes packaged with a big wish list of other kinks.

It's a big ask if the intention is to change the nature of what night already be a long term relationship.

 

From all of the posts I have read over the years this is most likely caused by men who push chastity onto their wives to fulfill their own selfish kinky needs in a way they deem appropriate to satisfy those needs. The fantasy they build up in their heads is mostly based on watching too much unrealistic porn which in turn puts a ton of work on the wife and usually makes her feel uncomfortable and used in those situations. So basically in a nutshell they go about it all wrong. Many of us on here are guilty of this also. Myself included. Ideally male chastity works quite well when the woman discovers this and would like to try it. It can work if the male initiates the idea but only if he hasn't been fully corrupted by the porn aspect of it all.

 

I never understood that mind set. I don't need to lock up to want my wife to be happy and to love her. I stay locked because we BOTH enjoy it

 

I may start a firestorm with this one. But.......

Chastity = Religion.
Not everyone believed the same thing at the same time.
Not everyone adopts the same beliefs.
You can’t force your ideologies on someone else.
Everyone must walk their own walk.
Actions speak louder than words.
Time reveals and strengthens the truth.
Respect for ones belief or disbelief is crucial.

 

My wife denies my orgasms, and she likes my devotion to her when I'm horny and submissive, but she sees no need to lock me up, and I'm ok with that.

 

Almost any good male chastity related publication will point out exactly what you have just said.
He's spent weeks months even years getting up the courage to introduce something to his wife/partner that he has been fantasising about probably for even longer. Then when he finally broaches the subject he expects her get fully on board immediately in exactly the way he wants.

Yeah how likely is that?

All whilst not considering for a moment that he has just informed his wife that for the last X long the focus of his fantasies has not been her.... but rather his fantasy has been (in her eyes) him NOT having sex with her.

And he expects this to work because......


Some people ...its easier to describe to them the smell of the colour 9

 

Calling a spade a spade is the first step. It’s not about serving, or about their wife if they know she’s not into it. That doesn’t mean you can’t ask her to indulge you, do you a favor, or play a role...just don’t pretend or assert it’s about anything else than you.

Partners can be giving, can indulge in another’s fantasies, and do things that they normally would not for someone they love. In fact when people here ask for advice on how to bring it up to a spouse I usually tell them...ask. Just don’t make it sound like you are doing them this grand favor, or act like your behavior will improve with her in charge of your orgasms. It might certainly be true, but that just screams that you are aware of your behavior, and need to be sexually frustrated to act like a giving partner. Again this may be entirely true but they certainly don’t want to know that your behavior is tied to your sexual interest. Their thought would be “why can’t you do those things without a cage on your dick”.

Chastity can evolve into servitude, and FLR might be a natural progression, it can also just stay a favor you are asking her to indulge you on, maybe even in exchange for a favor for her.

 

I cannot enjoy any type of sex/fetish with someone who is not enjoying what they are doing. Similarly I would never enter into a relationship with a woman who is not willing to try new things before deciding if they like something or not. If I even suspect that the woman is only doing something to win my favor, I will stop because my pleasure is mostly derived from the woman's.

 

Simply ...

Servitude.
If you want to serve her - then serve her in the ways she wants you to.

Chastity.
Its only going to be successful if you both have both feet in.

Successful relationships.
Consistent & honest communication is key no matter what aspects you want to be part of it.

Fantasy versus reality.
Keep your eyes on the stars but your feet on the ground.

[having fun with colors]

 

Interesting--for us it was the other way around. Servitude progressed into an FLR, and only then did chastity ever enter the picture.

It's natural, and not a big deal, for someone to try to get their spouse to indulge their sexual fantasies. It's all in how it's done: patiently, respectfully, and open-endedly (accepting that maybe the answer will be no and stay no), or like a self-pitying brat stomping your foot petulanly. You might get somewhere with the former approach, while the latter approach is self-defeating, and in the specific case of "submissiveness" amusingly hypocritical.

 

It's not actually a paradox any more than:

"I'm gay and in love with my straight friend.

If you love your friend, then you should stop being attracted to him."

Submission is an orientation or as near as damn it to one.

 

I wouldn't say it's a 'paradox', more like 'self-obsessive fetish' (as all fetishes are). Chastity, like any other kink, is a 'me me me' behaviour; as long as you understand that, you have a basis to deal with it when it can threaten to destroy your life. We've all seen posts here and elsewhere from fellows who are bound and determined to get their wives to cuckold them, no matter what. You can't explain that in terms of being submissive to what 'she wants'. It's what the guy wants, period.

That's not to say you can't love your partner and want to share experiences that you might both enjoy. Obviously that's a perfectly reasonable thing to do. But dealing with sexual behaviour involves very basic, primal instincts; the conscious part of the mind works hard to come up with some sort of ad hoc reasoning to justify powerful desires of self-fulfillment. A similar analogy would be someone who might want to lose weight or stop smoking; they do little to nothing to alter their actions, but can come up with all sorts of explanations as to why they were unable to do so - "I'm under a lot of stress"; "I'm having diet soda with my three Big Macs"; "I'm just big-boned"; "one cigarette won't hurt" and so on.

People practice their kink because they want to. If they can get their partner on board, great. But you're lying to yourself and harming your relationship if you pretend that you can "change her". It's not just topping from the bottom, it's obsessive control bordering on psychopathic megalomania. And brought about by pure unadulterated sexual drive. I know a lot of people will read this and say, "Oh, that's not me! I worship my Mistress/wife/lover!" Probably so. Ask yourself this: if she were to suddenly tell you that she just loves some bizarre food (like fish topped with cherries or sugar on hamburgers) and she wants you to eat it with her every day, how many times would you have to say "no" before it becomes a serious problem between you?

But don't get me wrong; we're all free to indulge in our fantasies to a point; but I don't think many guys realize that trying to steamroller their fantasy onto their partners sometimes goes too far. Why? Because as I said, it's 'me me me'. "I wear the cage, I pretend I'm a slave, so you have to do it, like it or not." That's when you cross the line from 'sharing' to 'inflicting'. An odd thing to do to someone you 'worship'.

Before you reply to complain, I'm well aware that not everyone is like this. But a lot are.

 

You are not mentioning his generous offer to lick the bottom of her shoes clean with no expectation of her having to do anything for him in return.

 

Without wishing to stoke said fires...

Chastity<>Religion
Chastity is demonstrably real.

 

I agree Chastity is real.

Religion may be defined as a cultural system of designated behaviors and practices, worldviews, texts, sanctified places, prophecies, ethics, or organizations, which relates humanity to the supernatural, transcendental, or spiritual elements. However, there is no scholarly consensus over what precisely constitutes a religion (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion).

The definition above seems to fit chastity especially when you include the worship and service of a Domme, Woman, Mistress, or other. That seems pretty real.
BTW my posts on this issue are tongue-in-cheek comments.

 

Good to know.
Religion is fictional. Chastity is manifestly not.
Or in fact you could say chastity is manifest, religion is not.
I'll leave you to make up your own mind whether or not that is tongue in cheek.

 

Well, it's a great question!
Men must find a way to make it less weird, more fun, and win-win.
It's so powerful to a lot of guys it's hard to think straight and be patient, and approach it gently and respectfully and find aspects that work over time.