Why do we want male chastity to be normalised...

Discussion in 'Chastity and orgasm denial' started by Giles_English, Aug 24, 2021.

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  1. LockedGreg
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    I kind of rant it to become mainstream since I very much promote the idea of social nudity. If chastity was mainstream, wearing a cage in a socially nude situation wouldn't be forcing my kink on others. Like, of socially we all knew some guys are caged, then me wearing a cage whole nude around people (adults) isn't a thing anymore.
     
  2. HusbandX
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    Perhaps.

    I don't normally open a dinner conversation at a public restaurant with a detailed description of my last bowel movement, either.

    Everything in its time and place.
     
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  3. Lazlo Toth
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    Lazlo Toth C/D on the TomAllen-Rectrix scale: 9/9

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    I looked for a similar reply, but did not see one. So if I am overlapping anyone's opinion, my apologies.

    I think the desire for Mainstreaming chastity is really a version of the exhibitionist fetish.

    It certainly is for me. If no one knows I am locked, it's not much fun. We read countless posts of eager lockees looking for keyholders. WHY? Can't they click the lock themselves? Of course we all can. But what makes it "hawt" (as Tom Allen says) is that at least ONE other person knows about it.

    So if chastity is "mainstream" it isn't that we want it to be common, it's that we want some plausible way to expose ourselves as being chaste.
     
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  4. true42
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    true42 Owned member

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    Yeah, we're some really weird monkeys.
     
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  5. sandman9355
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    My take on this is that one strong driving force behind the wishes for chastity to be more mainstream is the fact that being outed as a chastity enthusiast often has lots of negative consequences now. Of course, arguments like better devices apply too, but I'd say that's more of a side benefit. Possible consequences of getting outed, on the other hand, are a risk to everyone and unlikely to improve much even with better toys. Other men, even friends, might consider one weak, emasculated, perverted and so on and the consequences might be permanent even if the chastity device is just an experiment or an irregular short-term play. Women are often quite picky and not tolerant of what they perceive as not-normal, plus most women don't actually want submissive men, so possible consequences also include lower chances of finding a partner.

    Should the mainstream perceptions change to consider chastity play on the same level as oral sex or using a vibe, much of the fear and shame and rejection and other negative things that go with chastity kink today would be gone or significantly weaker. If women would see men wishing to be caged on the same level as they see men happy to use a vibe on them, if regular men would see caged men as acceptable as men willing to eat pussy, life would be easier for both chastity enthusiasts and the others.
     
  6. HusbandX
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    What are the negative consequences?
     
  7. Jessica Alexander
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    Jessica Alexander Trans woman not a mistress or Dom

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    I'm going to sound like a heretic here but many of the problems in our society are a direct consequence of weak men and lack of good male role models in the daily lives of our children. Most women don't want to work 80 hours a week for their whole adult lives in the pursuit of a big paycheck. That's why men on average earn more and die younger. I don't think most strong women want weak men which is why chastity will always remain justa kink. This is a great book which explains why "nice guys" finish last in almost every dimension. https://nomoremrniceguy.com/
     
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  8. sandman9355
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    Let's mention a few examples:
    - a long-time partner leaving,
    - religious former friends declaring one a pervert and breaking off contact,
    - majority/all women in a group refusing to consider one as a partner out of peer pressure,
    - losing a job due to a prejudiced boss/coworkers even though the stated reason is something else.

    Is that enough for you? Because AFAIK all of these have happened to some people.
     
  9. sandman9355
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    I'm going to sound like a witch-hunter here, even though I do agree with some of what you've said. Reason one being, people have different reasons for wishing to be locked / being okay with a locked partner. Reason two, not every man who is into chastity play is weak in other aspects of his life.

    And I'd say this debate isn't about most couples switching to chastity play, so things like strong women who don't want weak men don't play that big a role. This is about most people becoming okay with *some* people enjoying chastity play.
     
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  10. LockedPom
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    If Chastity was normalised, then surely it would be less humiliating, which somewhat defeats the purpose of it for some of us?
     
  11. Jessica Alexander
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    Jessica Alexander Trans woman not a mistress or Dom

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    Agreed. It was worded broadly and I agree that there is definitely a place for chastity with strong men.
     
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  12. HusbandX
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    Enough for me? I didn't cite a quota. But, no, it's not. Those are very thin, sketchy reasons, with nothing to support them.

    AFAIK, if I understand teenager-speak correctly, means "as far as I know" for people who are too lazy to type. It also means nothing, as the phrase itself means that you don't know what you're talking about. It's an unqualified qualifier. "Some people" is very trumpian. A lot of people say. Some people think. Many people believe. Whatever.

    You're saying the danger of chastity becoming mainstream is that a long time parter might leave? How does that work out and why is that the fault of society becoming more accepting of a given concept, or idea. Sounds a lot like a personal problem.

    Is this supposed to suggest that if one is locked up and the practice of locking up a male becomes mainstream, the female might arbitrarily elect to abandon the relationship? Why? Because it's no longer "taboo?" Reality check: if she's headed out the door, then chastity becoming mainstream has nothing to do with it. Nothing. Better look for another crack in the relationship; I guarantee that there are plenty. Sounds like a fallacy on multiple levels, and non-sequitur logic. With that logic, next time the barn burns down, we should dehorn all the cows. It just makes no sense.

    You're worried about "religious former friends," and what they may think? Did you reason this one out? If they're former friends, why do you care what they think?

    We're talking about chastity becoming mainstream. So, you have "former religious friends," and they were quite accepting of you when chastity was still not mainstream, but the moment it becomes acceptable, they abandon and forsake you as a pervert? You're saying that when chastity wasn't okay, wasn't accepted, they accepted you. When it has become acceptable, they reject you? Roll that around for a while and then try again. Entirely illogical, even if we set aside your preoccupation with "former friends" who might reject you, and "former friends" that break off contact. If they're "former friends," haven't you, or they, already broken contact?

    If chastity becomes mainstream and widely accepted in social circles, this will cause the majority, or even all of the women in a group to ostracize "one as a partner," out of peer pressure? That one is going to take some work, and an explanation. By becoming widely accepted, the end result is to cause all members of a female group to reject someone as part of the group? Are the rejecting a male, or a female, and for what possible reason? If the assumption is that chastity presently isn't mainstream and socially acceptable, you're suggesting that this "one as a partner" person is accepted, but that if chastity becomes socially approved on a large scale, this "one as a partner" person is now rejected? Seems similar logic to "former" friends. No logic.

    If chastity becomes mainstream and socially acceptable, one may lose a job as a result? Based on what?

    Of course, perhaps you mean that presently, if one engages in chastity, one may lose a long term partner. Again, if that's what causes your relationship to fail, that's not what's caused your relationship to fail. There are bigger reasons, and more than one. Any relationship is a two way street, and it's a relationship between two (or more) people. Chastity doesn't cause it to fail. A cat doesn't cause it to fail any more than a coffee cup, or a cloud in the sky. The partners failing to work together to make the partnership is what causes relationships to fail, and chief among the contributing factors will nearly always be communication. Don't blame chastity, whether you perceive it to be "mainstream," or "taboo."

    Again, setting aside the issue of what your "former religious friends" think of you, If you believe that chastity will cause them to point fingers at you and consider you a pervert, then it may be in your best interest that they're former friends and not current friends, and you may be too invested in what former friends think of you. Who is living your life? Them, or you? How did they learn of your chastity? Did you tell them? Did they spy on you? Did you decide to make what was private, a public thing? Whose decision is that, and where does this fault lay? If you believe chastity is acceptable and right for you and others are too ignorant or immature to understand or support that, who has the problem? If your religious friends are christian and can't apply the most basic principles of accepting and loving you for who you are, and if they rush to judgement, then the condemnation is theirs. This isn't the fault of chastity, mainstream, "taboo," or otherwise. Part of the fault is theirs for being judgemental, part yours for outing yourself, and entirely yours for giving a shit about what they think. This, especially given that chastity is considered a higher standard by nearly all the world's religions. Let's face it, even the mother of Christ was reportedly a virgin at the time of her conception; an essential element to her birthing the son of God was that she was chaste.

    The same may be said for a woman or man in a group of women who might reject a member of that group for engaging in chastity, regardless of how sainted, enlightened, pious, proper, or popular any one of them might be.

    As for work...really?

    No, not good enough. Not good enough at all.
     
  13. tecolote
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    tecolote Long term member

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    Exactly. So stop pretending that using a chastity cage is somehow viewed the same way that abstaining from sex is viewed. One is taboo/rarely heard of by some groups. The other is something that is widely accepted.
     
  14. HusbandX
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    I made no such "pretense." Put words in your own mouth, if you think yourself able. Not mine. You needn't attempt to speak for me. I speak very well for myself.

    Chastity is the act of abstaining from sex. There are many ways to go about it, from simple self-discipline to mechanical discipline (which for many, is still self-discipline). Chastity is far more than abstaining from sex, but in the context of this forum, for certain posters, is about teasing, denial, sexual dynamics, etc. At its core, a chastity cage IS abstaining from sex. Unless you intend to shove that cage somewhere and hope for the best. Then again, for certain individuals, chastity IS sex. Likewise, so is chocolate, aerobatics, poetry, motorcycle riding, and drag racing.

    A taboo, which is a contravention to societal norms and sometimes illegal, sometimes illicit, offensive, disruptive, unaccepted and not tolerated, must be heard of by a given group, culture, society, or organization, in order for it to be a "taboo." If the group hasn't heard of it, it can't really be taboo. Think.

    Now you've said that chastity is widely accepted. You may do well to make up your mind.

    Your comments are based on assumptions not in evidence.
     
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    That's exactly how I feel. I am who I am. If it were more mainstream, I would have cottoned on to it sooner, and would have made a lot of self discovery earlier in my life, and made my wife happier sooner.

    Have to admit that there is a bit of an evangelical element to how we feel sometimes. We preach communication, and devotion to our S/Os and I see people struggling with relationships that perhaps could do with trying it. However, I refrain, and perhaps just make an easily brushed off comment like "I've not been happier since I started putting my wife first in everything"
     
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    Excellent points well said.

    I do slightly take exception to the comment from others that "Nobody surely wants vanilla" It isn't very submissive.

    What if the "I like it because it is kinky" group had a vanilla partner who wants nothing more than her man saving himself for her. Would that be a relationship breaker? I certainly have a kinkier mind than my vanilla wife, but this is her show now. My pleasure is making her happy. That's the whole point of "lifestyle" chastity. The kinky stuff is a bonus, but it isn't the foundation that holds everything together.
     
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    Is it mostly the taboo though that turns people on though? Or is it mostly the inaccessibility aspect, or the fact that I can't get off or have a proper erection without permission, or the addictive nature of denial, or the wonderful feeling when you haven't come for so long and you are more horny than you have ever been and the slightest touch sends you into bliss. The taboo certainly had a role to play in the fantasy of being a chaste male, but in reality, after the first few weeks, for me, it has no part in my reasoning for staying locked and moving from play to lifestyle. Though if you have read my blog, I've worn a cage pretty much full time from day one, and decided very quickly that I wanted to make a go of it for her.
     
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    Maybe some people get off on being submissive,.more so here on CM. However, locking up can be thought of as a strength. I'm a strong confident man in charge of others by day, and devoted to my wife. The cage (which regulates hormones) helps my alpha side to be more sensitive to her needs
     
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  19. tecolote
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    tecolote Long term member

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    Are we playing the game of cherry picking definitions to fit the argument? I'll play...

    Taboo: something that is not acceptable to say, mention, or do : something that is taboo.

    In other words, something that you wouldn't discuss over dinner. Think
     
  20. HusbandX
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    You just made that up, didn't you?

    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/taboo

    Taboo as a definition:
    1a. banned on grounds of morality or taste
    1b. banned as constituting a risk
    2. forbidden to profane use or contact because of what are held to be dangerous supernatural powers


    Used as a noun:
    1a. a prohibition imposed by social custom or as a protective measure
    1b. something that is not acceptable to say, mention, or do : something that is taboo
    2. prohibition against touching, saying, or doing something for fear of immediate harm from a supernatural force

    Used as a verb:
    1. to set apart as taboo especially by marking with a ritualistic symbol
    2. to avoid or ban as taboo

    Presumably you did a quick internet search and came up with use as a noun, 1b, but have misapplied the meaning; you're playing with the definition to twist it into something else: you are applying your own definition.

    Chastity is not banned on grounds of morality or taste, nor as constituting a risk, nor has it anything to do with supernatural powers. It's not prohibited by social custom or by any protective measure.

    If you live in a society that's so delicate that "chastity" cannot be mentioned, it's not chastity. It's you.

    I realize that you want to believe yourself to be some kind of sexual rebel, engaging in a daring "taboo" so forbidden, so reprehensible that society shudders at the mere thought and would burn you at the stake in an instant if it only knew, but the truth is that if you're chaste, you're just some guy not having sex. Kind of ho-hum. But if it helps you to think you're in a stephen king novel of sexual suspense and depravity, knock yourself out and have a ball.

    You're so taboo, man. You're like, the tabooest guy in the room. An original. So gnarly. And at the same time, tubular. Totally taboo. It makes sleeping with my sister seem passe, and those goats? Mainstream. Dick cage? Sooooo bad. Wow. And no sex? How do you do it, man? Unbelievable. Can't believe we're talking about it, 'cause it's totally taboo, knowhatI'msaying?
     
  21. tecolote
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    tecolote Long term member

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    #46 tecolote, Aug 27, 2021
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 29, 2021
    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/taboo

    Entry 2 of 3 (b)

    As for the rest of your post, you certainly are insufferable, aren't you? You probably don't even need a cage except... Oh right, your hand.

    Mod note - language moderated
     
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  22. LockedTower
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    Ouch! That's a nasty chastity burn.

    This thread really broke down toward the end. People getting so specific and arguing over tiny differences. I thought I was reliving an argument with my teenage daughter for a minute there. Everyone has their own thoughts and ideas, let's try not to discourage anyone from sharing them.
     
  23. Robins toy
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    Thank you. I was chomping at my bit, wanting to chime in.

    Tolerance of different points of view seems rare these days, especially from those that have a different perspective or point of view!
     
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  24. sandman9355
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    Quite funny to read that, given the circumstances. I was using the acronym years before today's teenagers were born. And it was never meant to mean one doesn't know what one's talking about - quite the opposite, in fact. It is most often those with limited knowledge who don't wish to admit there might be gaps in their knowledge. And overused politicized words like "trumpian" feel like a self-diagnosis when you're talking to someone who might not live in the US (hint - I don't).

    You do remember you specifically asked about reasons why getting outed as a chastity enthusiast might have negative consequences today, right?

    I wasn't saying that chastity becoming mainstream could make long-term partner leave one. I said that today's perception of chastity play is such that many people find it too weird for their tastes. And the same logic applies to my other arguments.

    And you *have* to pretend you have to take everything literally, eh? How about "former" friends as in "newly former because they consider sex toys and kinky play unacceptable" friends? Feels like you live in a liberal area. So do I. But quite many people on this planet don't and you might want to remember that.

    One, I've never had a relationship fail due to chastity myself. Two, it is really easy to find accounts of people for whom their interest in chastity play was the last straw that made their relationship fail. Three, you seem surprisingly eager to deny how picky many women are about their partners.

    Uh... You do know that women in workplaces are even nastier towards other women than men are, right? You really think a majority of women are willing to date known caged guy? Women consider four out of five men to be bellow average as is, so you really think most women are okay with being seen as "the one who's so desperate she's dating that emasculated pervert"?

    Imagine living in a small town in more religious parts of America. Or in a country or state where sex toys are actually illegal. Or working with children.

    Still think getting outed can't be bad for one?
     
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  25. tecolote
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    I do hope you are mocking me at least a little bit. It was a lame dig that I regret including in the post. Apopogies to @HusbandX for suggesting that he can't get laid. He probably can, and on the off chance he can't, it's not something that should be mocked lightly.
     
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