More secure cage lock?

Discussion in 'Chastity device discussions and reviews' started by FuturePerfect, Nov 21, 2017.

  1. FuturePerfect
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    FuturePerfect Member

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    A few weeks ago I got ill and really wanted to remove my appliance because it hurt. The key was not available, but it struck me that I had about 12 similar keys for my various cages, and one might fit. It did, and I was free. This was both a relief and a disappointment: the locks are not very secure.

    It got me wondering how many unique keys shapes there are for the locks that most cages use, which I think are: https://www.burg.biz/international/p/locks-and-bolts/e7me/. These appear to be 3-pin tumbler locks. The internet reveals that a normal-size pin-tumbler lock has about 10 pin lengths per pin. I'd guess our small cage locks have 5-6 pin lengths. If 5, that's 125 combinations. (Further restricted because normally one doesn't have a minimum pin length next to a maximum pin length because the key can end up too spiky.)

    To attempt to confirm this, I used a micrometer on my locks' keys, hoping there there would be clumps of lengths, so revealing the number of pin lengths. The results were inconclusive, but it looked crudely as though there were about 7 pin length groups. However, with no clear divisions between the clumps' lengths, I suspect in practice the lengths run into each other. This would be reasonable because the range, minimum to maximum length, was 1.34mm, which would make each nominal pin length about 0.2mm distant from its neighbour. If my presumptions are correct, this makes the locks even less secure as, say, a length-4 pin might be opened by a length-5 key prong.

    To improve security I've resolved to keep two thoroughly different locks/keys and to bin the rest.

    So, I wonder if anybody knows of a physically compatible lock.
     
  2. guest 2942
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    guest 2942 Long term member

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    some of the devices that use that type of lock also have a hole at the end designed for a cable tie lock. You slide that through the entire lock and clip it closed. It can only be removed with wire cutters. If you want to add this to your device simply drill a hole at the opposite end the key goes in and buy a lock that is hallow and some cable ties. If you need more info let me know.
     
  3. maid julie
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    maid julie Long term member

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    I would be interested in more info about the cable tie addition, thanks
     
  4. zorglub
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    zorglub Tether freak

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    These "integrated locks" are either genuine Burg Wachter ME/2, or Chinese knock-offs thereof. A lock that came with a below-$100 cage is pretty likely to be a knock-off. While they all have 3 pins, there is a marked difference in quality between the genuine German-made locks and the much cheaper knock-offs. I would be surprised if the knock-offs had as many pin lengths as the genuine Burg Wachters.
     
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  5. guest 2942
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    guest 2942 Long term member

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    @maid julie , you can buy the cable seals here. http://malechastitynow.com/Chastity-Device-Accessories/Security-Seals. You will also need the magic locker that has a hole through it. Most of the chinease ones have no hole. this is the original manufacturer of the locks with the hole through the middle. The one you need is the ME2. Select version and scroll down to the bottom. https://www.burg.biz/international/p/locks-and-bolts/e7me/. And of course the device has to have the whole also so if there isn't one just drill the hole.
     
  6. FuturePerfect
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    Thanks for your comments, zorglub.

    I have eight Burg Wachter ME/2 and three Chinese locks.

    The Chinese locks are patently inferior: rougher brass casing and their keys are much looser.

    I have just checked all of my key/lock combinations: the two locks I have with identical keys are from Burg Wachter.

    Alas, nobody has replied identifying a lock superior to the Burg Wachter. I shall follow my original plan and discard all except two, thoroughly different, German locks. (Cable ties or numbered tags don't work for me; I'm trying to defeat myself.)
     
  7. maid julie
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    maid julie Long term member

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    Thanks for the info
     
  8. FuturePerfect
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    Update. Of the three Chinese locks I have (each supplied with a stainless steel 'Holy Trainer 2') two of them are keyed identically.
     
  9. FuturePerfect
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    Another update.

    I've just received a Holy Trainer 3 (so far, even more comfortable than the HT2). Its lock is the same size and shape as before, but I don't think it's a BW. The key is shorter, has a three-digit number marked on the fob and it appears to have four cylinders. Good - I started this thread because of concerns over the security of these locks.
     
  10. FuturePerfect
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    This is just so depressing. Somebody must know of a more secure lock.

     
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  11. Alceste
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    Alceste Chaste Member

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    I have picked those brass locks with a paper clip in a few seconds. They have only 3 pins.

    They were actually invented to block and lock the keyway of a skeleton key, say on an old desk, not for a high security application.

    Small padlocks are also easy to open, you don't even have to pick the cylinder, since the latching mechanism is exposed at the end of the keyway. Opening it only takes a paper clip and a second or two.
     
  12. tvalex
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    tvalex Long term member

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    just goes to prove what I knew already. These Chinese locks are rubbish.
    I have a few devices. And all the keys will open the other locks.
     
  13. NT36
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    I believe most locks of this size are relatively basic. You may want to try a combination lock of sorts. I think the best option would be a PA piercing but that scares me somewhat
     
  14. garner
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    I would say one the most secure lock for a chastity device is not a actual lock, but a security screw, that is what i have heard and read. I know that the manufacturer Lori's have had their own security screw and bit developed " only " for them, that have a very unique screw that only their bit will fit in 100%

    To increase the security on their chastity device. All screw used on a Lori's chastity device are receded, so that it will be impossible, so that you can't use pliers to try and loosen the screw.

    Lori's even claim that if you try and loose their screw with a bit that does not have 100% grip on their security screw, there is then a high chance that you end up stripping the screwhead / bit. This will cause that now not even the original screw can't loosen the security and then you really have a serious problem.
     
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  15. FuturePerfect
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    I am gradually coming to the view that specialized security screws are the way to go. Nobody has suggested a secure lock with the same dimensions as the Burg Wachter model. Small dangling padlocks are generally not that difficult to pick and they usually expose the hasp to cutting.

    The only appliance makers I know of that use security screws are Lori and Steelwerksextreme. I have limited knowledge of how well their security works, though one person I know says his Lori is effectively inescapable. Perhaps others have different views.

    My problem is that after years of searching I've finally found a device that works and is wearable long-term: a Steelheart with PA capture and the non-standard security loop added underneath. (I'm uncut but have a PA - this severely limits my choice.) However, the Steelheart integrated lock is feeble, as the disheartening YouTube vid shows.
     
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  16. Alceste
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    Alceste Chaste Member

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    #16 Alceste, Mar 2, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2020
    I have a Steelwerksextreme. The locking screws are well designed and not possible to remove without either the key, or by destroying the screw. They are either recessed so that you cannot grab it, or are fitted with a collar which spins freely, so again you cannot grab it.

    My general position on security is that a device should prevent tampering in a moment when you are frustrated, and it must be obvious if defeated by removal of the device or any component part.
     
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  17. FuturePerfect
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    FuturePerfect Member

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    Thanks for your comment, Alceste. May I ask which design you have?

    I'm considering a SteelwerksExtreme device, though my needs are a little specialised: I have a PA piercing, but I'm uncut. I see no evidence that their devices handle that combination.

    I'm prepared to spend silly money, but I want the damn thing to work.
     
  18. Alceste
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    Alceste Chaste Member

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    Mine is a variant of his "Short Story" design. There are pictures of it in my gallery.

    Talk to him. He likes challenges and his approach is both as an engineer and as an artisan.
     
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  19. FuturePerfect
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    FuturePerfect Member

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    Thanks, Alceste. I shall investigate further.
     
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